tcahill
I would really like a zoom function in extended view that let me zoom in and out of the plex itself. I'd like to be able to zoom out to see the whole picture and then zoom in close by scaling everything up/down in relative proportions. Wasn't this function previously available? Did it get lost somewhere along the way?

Now that I've got the expanded view save and open feature, I want to step back and look at my work!
Be vewy quiet. I'm hunting wabbit.
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Darkstar
The only zooming in and out I can remember in the plex is making the font size bigger/smaller using the mouse wheel or the drag circle.

You can do multi-page printing in some version of PB, and those effectively "Zoom in" on paper--- but only for the VISIBLE plex area of the window.
-Darkstar
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jostber
I would like that zoom function for selected regions too.
TheBrain 8.0.2.0 Slackware 14.1 KDE 4.10.3 Java 1.7.0_25 / (Windows 7)

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tcahill
tcahill wrote: INow that I've got the expanded view save and open feature, I want to step back and look at my work!

***Note*** I'm glad to see interest in this idea. To make the thread easier to view, I've replaced the large graphic with a much reduced version. I've included the before image, the poster picture, and the result image in the archive.zip file attached.***Note***

So, pardon the scrolling, but I thought I'd illustrate the power that Extended View zoom would bring to productivity..

First, I created an extended view that I then took several screen captures of.

The image is a photo of the poster that I'd assembled by printing out individual pages and taping them together. I hand marked-up this poster as I confirmed organizational characteristics.

Using this, I created some sub-heading thoughts that could create more order to the overall set of thoughts (this portion of my plex shows the TikiWiki groupware permissions as they relate to elements of a wiki site)




Click image for larger version - Name: poster.png, Views: 448, Size: 468.64 KB
Be vewy quiet. I'm hunting wabbit.
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twospoons
Now that's a good suggestion.  Being able to create logical groupings of thoughts and then creating relationships between the groupings would essentially create a 3D drill-down/zoom effect to the plex.

Is there any practical reason that these groupings couldn't be based on types or tags or maybe even a filtered view?  And then allowing links between these views for navigation at the current detail level or at a higher summary level.
Wes
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tcahill
twospoons wrote: Now that's a good suggestion.  Being able to create logical groupings of thoughts and then creating relationships between the groupings would essentially create a 3D drill-down/zoom effect to the plex.

Nicely put. I've been dreaming of an intelligent 'dynamic plex background" that was not a static colour map or graphic but was instead an integral part of the information display. It may have come up somewhere once or twice before. Of course, in an interconnected plex, you are always going to have some thought links crossing through intermediate sections to link widely dispersed groups.

And that segues  to the other idea: a 3D plex. Well that's very 20th century. I imagine Harlan presenting at a 2015 TED conference wrote: ... In fact, as we can only see in three dimensions, the plex renders itself in three rotational perpendicular planes. See how you can rotate around and transit through the plex. With a simple gesture, we change the orientation of our view of the current representation in three dimensions: forward/back, left/right, up/down (crowd: "oooh"). 

However, the plex is n-dimensional, and reconfigures itself on the fly to cast a 3D shadow of a desired data-slice, that we easily recognize as a pseudo-mandala representation of our information. Using the scroll wheel, we can seamlessly switch kaleidoscopically through available data dimensions to be represented in the plex.... (Crowd on its feet, roaring approval)


twospoons wrote:
Is there any practical reason that these groupings couldn't be based on types or tags or maybe even a filtered view?  And then allowing links between these views for navigation at the current detail level or at a higher summary level.


Uh huh. Referencing the diagram, I used both types and tags to impose the over-all structure that I'd identified. The result is satisfactory to the purpose at hand.

Now that I have these groupings, it would be nice to be able to move them together, locked in place only with reference to the defined group. It would be great if the group's colour could radiate a 'glow' that surrounds itself. Perhaps the colours of two groups could combine (a-la colour theory) where a thought was on the boundary of two groups....
Be vewy quiet. I'm hunting wabbit.
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twospoons
Have you looked at the spacial view inside the mozilla aurora concept yet?  They call their grouping a "cluster", but it is the same idea for views and they even have a nice coloured glow around it

http://adaptivepath.com/aurora/
Wes
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mbaas
tcahill wrote: tcahill wrote: INow that I've got the expanded view save and open feature, I want to step back and look at my work!


So, pardon the scrolling, but I thought I'd illustrate the power that Extended View zoom would bring to productivity..

First, I created an extended view that I then took several screen captures of.

The image is a photo of the poster ....


Wow, it looks quite impressive, but very difficult to 'get' the view on my small laptop screen. Any chance you could post these thoughts as a brain?
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twospoons

Is that really the point though, to see everything on one screen?  Or is it to see an overview of the abstract groupings layer and then see the detailed thoughts as you zoom into a particular group?

Wes
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tcahill
twospoons wrote:

Is that really the point though, to see everything on one screen?  Or is it to see an overview of the abstract groupings layer and then see the detailed thoughts as you zoom into a particular group?



Right. IMO, the benefit is in seeing the larger patterns in a zoomed overview, and the local details closer in.

Actually, the poster displays only one perspective on the data, that which groups permissions by structural element. Another perspective groups the permissions by their actions (in this plex I call actions 'verbs'). I've not yet been able to combine both structures in a 2 dimensional representation that is meaningful, as the result is very chaotic.
Be vewy quiet. I'm hunting wabbit.
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twospoons
A couple of additional points to consider...
Wes
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tcahill
twospoons wrote: A couple of additional points to consider...


To your second point first: I'd be much more productive with either of the two uservoice suggestions you made. It seems that we are after the same general boost. I've long ago used up all of my votes, or I'd have voted for your suggestions.

I've more than one reason to desire a zoom in/out capability in epanded view:  1 You can only print what you can display in one screen, 2 See the big picture (spot big picture patterns) 3 Link widely dispersed thoughts. And that list is without the benefit of any coffee. Gotta go....
Be vewy quiet. I'm hunting wabbit.
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Darkstar
I'm all for "zooming/drilling" of thoughts. I've suggested it many, many time.

There's no reason I can think of that a thought couldn't represent a whole sub-set of thoughts (a filtered view). Could have a few controls on a thought to "drill down" (go into that filtered view), expand it in place (showing all the contained thoughts in place), or compress an expanded thought down to its containing thought.
-Darkstar
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Cornan
Two things...

One observation is that Expanded View in its current form seems to want to push off the screen anything that isn't related by an on screen link.  (i.e. I might want to zoom my entire brain, not just the areas with currently visible on-screen links).

In my mind it would be better for PB to implement a kind of relationship gravity, that would act even for non-visible links and bring together islands that only appear to be unrelated.

In my brains all thoughts are ultimately linked to the Home thought, so to my way of thinking the Expanded View plex should never show an isolated handful of thoughts on an empty background.

The blue sky version of this idea would implement some kind of Expanded view user setting (slider?) for "gravity", ranging from today's (IMO) extreme setting of "repel all thoughts with non-visible links" (negative gravity) through settings that would bring islands on-screen with varying amounts of "buffer" space between them, to a maximum gravity setting that would space thoughts with no on screen relationships as closely as the thoughts with visible links.


Second, it seems that we have the possible underpinnings of one drill-down mechanism already in the Super Type hierarchy, which I see nobody has mentioned before on this thread.

In something like a data design, the Super Types could extend down from the enterprise through databases through fields, for example.

Here I'm saying that users might want explicit control features for the drill-down (Super Type hierarchy, "drill-down level" in each thought) as well as automatic / inferential methods derived from links.

In a similar way, all major Internet search engines today expose only a generic search (guessing) interface, which often fails.  Alta Vista once supported Boolean search expressions, as do some of the specialized search engines (job search sites, for example) today, and until it was quietly decommissioned, I always used Alta Vista.

Inference and guesing by either a search engine or a PB zoom function can never be as powerful as directly supplied information. 
 
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asexymind
This thread excites me. I have a 4 monitor setup, allowing me to put a lot of thoughts "in play" in my extended mode. even with 4 monitors, I end up with a map much bigger than I can fit. Currently, I create multiple views and toggle back and forth between them - not good...

I say Forget all the fancy stuff, I just want to be able to zoom in and out on the map I have created, so if I put 20 thoughts close together, I can meticulously arrange them at high zoom, then zoom out and have them be a small amorphous blob. :-)

NOW, if we could really zoom in and out. This changes the "font size" issue, and the "spacing" issue, because they are both relative to size. In order to fine tune, we would likely need to be able to:
1) choose and FIX the font size of a thought at a particular level of zoom. Change the zoom, change the font size.
2) choose and FIX the relative spacing between thoughts at a particular level of zoom.
3) this would allow me to create "parent" thoughts for a group of thoughts that is easily readable at one level of zoom, while the children are too small, while the parent becomes too big to read when looking at its grandchildren - SHOULD I CHOOSE...

:-)


--
Mark Michael Lewis | The Profitability Coach
http://GameOfThriving.com | Mark@TheThriveCoach.com
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