JohnDempsey
Version 5.5.1.0-b

I have a tag called "Risky credit". If I select this tag in the tag window I get a display of 25 thoughts which is correct.

If I set up a custom report in which the only parameter selected is the tag "Risky credit" and then filter by report content I only see one thought in the plex instead of 25.

Either this is a bug or I am misunderstanding something.

Regards
John
John Dempsey
Quote
dyslucksia
Hi John, welcome to the forum.

It's difficult to diagnose the problem based only on the information you have given us, but my impression is that it's unlikely to be a bug, more likely something in your filter setup that has cut the other thoughts out. Go over your thought types in case something in there might be doing it.

Quote: I only see one thought in the plex instead of 25

This may be because of the setting of your Report filter. Try it in each one of its three modes - on, off or inverted - that may help you.

If all else fails, post a screen shot of your custom report screen.

PB 5.5.2.1 on Windows XP, J-1.6.0_17
Quote
danlandrum
It is working as intended. Here are four important considerations:
  1. The report, be it custom or not, is the list that is returned in the reports window. 
  2. The plex is still the plex and does not become the reports window when it is filtered.
  3. The plex can be filtered by the reports window results.
  4. Filtering, by its very nature, removes items.


OSX 10.13 
iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Late 2015)
3.3 GHz Intel Core i5
32 GB 1867 MHz DDR3
Quote
JohnDempsey
Thanks to you both.

It appears to be me misunderstanding the functioning of reports. I do indeed see the correct results in the reports window but I had been expecting to see all the qualifying thoughts in the Plex also after pressing the filter button.

If I select my thought "Customers" I see approx 1500 child thoughts, each representing one of my customers. I had assumed that having selected the tag "Risky credit" in the report filter and then pressing the filter button, it would only show me the qualifying customers in the Plex itself.

I can't quite understand what the point of the filter button is then. I can see the qualifying customers in the report window without having to use the filter button so what is it's purpose?

I am obviously missing the point somehwere?

John
John Dempsey
Quote
dyslucksia
Hi John, glad you got the right number of reports to show up in the Plex at last.

Reports filter allows us apply any of the Reports filters to Thoughts in the actual Plex, not just to the selection box. We can make a thought visible or invisible depending on whether it has a particular tag or type. Even better, we can flip this around by inverting the filter, thus seeing only those Thoughts that do not meet the Reports filter criteria - a very powerful feature.

Take the time to create a small, simple test Brain with a handful of Thoughts and a couple of tags and types, and get lots of practice before applying it to your working Brains and risk deleting data or corrupting relationships. Don't combine Custom Reports with Reports filter till you're completely comfortable using either of these powerful tools to filter simple tags and types first.

PB 5.5.2.1 on Windows XP, J-1.6.0_17
Quote
JohnDempsey
But I haven't managed to get the correct number of thoughts to appear in the plex, only in the report window.

John
John Dempsey
Quote
danlandrum
John,

The plex is not a report window.

It took me a while to get used to this, and learn to work from the reports window instead, but it makes perfect sense now that I get it.  I think I was just so used to getting all my info from the plex, which is what we do as we're learning and setting up PB, that I assumed that is where all info is displayed.

I am understanding more and more that there is serious power for getting actual work done in understanding the reports window and the selection window(By actual work I mean processing the things I have to do to make money, none of which involve playing with my brain.)

Perhaps you might want to think of the plex as your desktop, and the reports window as something on your desktop. The selection window, then, is like a temporary bin you use to organize and move things around. 

Hope this helps. 

OSX 10.13 
iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Late 2015)
3.3 GHz Intel Core i5
32 GB 1867 MHz DDR3
Quote
JohnDempsey
Thanks for taking the time.

I understand the general concept except for the actual function of the filter button on the right of the reports window toolbar.

If I select a filter then the reports window shows just the filtered thoughts with no changes in the plex itself. Perfectly logical, just as one would expect.

If  I now press the filter button, the plex changes so presumably the filter button is designed to effect the view in the plex (is this a correct presumption?). The bit I don't understand is that after pressing this button the plex shows just one of the filtered items in the report window. I don't understand why only one and why the specific one, it isn't even the first or last in the filtered report window. There are no other filters set that would limit the selection to just this one

I hope I am making myself understood.

Regards
John
John Dempsey
Quote
danlandrum
The filtering doesn't add anything to the plex.  It is screens things from the plex.  If the main thought you are seeing in the plex doesn't have parents, siblings, or jumps associated with the report, then they disappear, or reappear in the case of inverse filtering. 
OSX 10.13 
iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Late 2015)
3.3 GHz Intel Core i5
32 GB 1867 MHz DDR3
Quote
Darkstar
JohnDempsey,

it sounds like all the rest of the thoughts from your report are "flying away" or starting out of view.

If you filter the plex, and the active thought "goes away" because it is not in the filter, PB picks a "random" thought left, and sets that as the active thought.

If that active thought is UNCONNECTED to anything else left, you end up only seeing that thought.

This sounds like what you are experiencing.

Select the "Risky Credit" tag. It should show you all your Risky Credit tagged customers. You can do this when the plex has been filtered, so those thoughts should suddenly come together under it, and with nothing else.
-Darkstar
Quote
JohnDempsey
Thanks to both of you for your replies although I am still confused.

I have set up a test brain with 4 child thoughts under the home thought. I have created a tag called tag1 and applied it to thoughts 1 and 2.

In the first screen shot I have selected tag 1 in the reports window. Since I haven't clicked the filter button, I correctly have thoughts 1 and 2 shown in the reports window and all 4 thoughts shown in the plex.

In the second screen shot I have clicked the filter button once and would therefore expect only thoughts 1 and 2 to remain in the plex but in fact only thought 2 is shown.

In the third screenshot I have clicked the filter button once more to exclude all tag 1 thoughts. The plex now correctly shows only thoughts 3 and 4.

So why do I get the behaviour I expected when using exclude filtering but not when include filtering.

Regards
John
Click image for larger version - Name: Screenshot_1.png, Views: 92, Size: 112.20 KB Click image for larger version - Name: Screenshot_2.png, Views: 92, Size: 114.06 KB Click image for larger version - Name: Screenshot_3.png, Views: 92, Size: 124.33 KB
John Dempsey
Quote
danlandrum
First screen shot:
The plex focus is on the thought Test Brain. Report filtering is off, so all of the focused thought's children are displayed.
Second screen shot:
You turned on normal filtering while the plex was focused on Test Brain. < - - - This is where you're getting confused

The plex filters out every thought that does not have tag 1, including Thought 3, Thought 4 and Test Brain. Test Brain disappeared because it doesn't have tag 1.

If I understand this correctly, and please, Moe or Harlan correct me if I'm wrong, the plex is designed to focus on one thought and its branching links. I am purposefully using the word links instead of relations. Personal Brain does not create/display/draw links to siblings, even though in our wet brains a thought's children are related as siblings.

So what should the plex show us now?

The two thoughts which correspond to the filter results are not linked. It picks one (I have no idea why it picks the one it does) and displays it.  Since it has no links which correspond to the filter, it takes center stage all by itself. 
Third screen shot:
Remember, this test began with the plex focused on the thought Test Brain. Since you, the user, did not change the focus by clicking on another thought, PB remembers the thought on which you began filtering - Test Brain.

You select inverse filtering and voila, Test Brain reappears as the focused thought, along with Thought 3 and Thought 4 because they have links to the focused thought, and meet the inverse report filter criteria.

Now, if this is starting to make sense, you can drive it home by adding one more thought to your test.  Begin with filtering turned off and try this:

  1. Create a thought called Thought 5 as a child of Thought 4 and give it your tag 1.
  2. Focus the plex on Thought 5.
  3. Don't touch the filter button yet.
  4. Remembering that the plex is focused on Thought 5, what will happen when you switch to filtering, and then inverse filtering?
  5. Change the plex focus to Thought 4 and ask yourself the same question.
  6. Do this with other thoughts in your test brain and it helps clarify the logic. 
Working with a test brain, like you're doing now, has helped me tremendously.  I hope this helps you too.
OSX 10.13 
iMac (Retina 5K, 27-inch, Late 2015)
3.3 GHz Intel Core i5
32 GB 1867 MHz DDR3
Quote
JohnDempsey
Thanks for your very detailed reply.

I can see what you are trying to say although I would personally prefer it to function differently.

I would feel much more confident of correctly interpreting the result of a filter on the plex if it took the plex display before applying the filter and then crossed out the displayed thoughts that do not meet the criteria. The structure of the displayed plex would not change but it would clearly indicate those thoughts that did and did not meet the criteria and enable the user to keep the overall perspective of the filtered thoughts relationships.

As it is, it relies too much on me interpreting the display correctly. It is too easy to assume that there is only one child thought with tag 1 set when in fact there are more but they have been removed from the initial plex display. This is exacerbated by the slightly arbitary way it appears to choose which one of the conforming thoughts to display.

Many thanks once again.
John
John Dempsey
Quote
zenrain
See also this and this post, I feel exactly the same way.
Windows 7
J-1.6.0_22
--
OSX 10.6.3
Java SE 6
Quote
JohnDempsey
Well I am relieved to know that I am not on my own here.

To my simple mind it is straight forward. The original non filtered plex display is maintained but any normal filtering crosses out the excluded thoughts and inverse filtering does the opposite.

I have often be accused of being simple though

Regards
John
John Dempsey
Quote

Add a Website Forum to your website.

Newsletter Signup  Newsletter Signup        Visit TheBrain Blog   Visit TheBrain Blog       Follow us on Twitter   Follow Us       Like Us on Facebook   Like Us         Circle Us on Google+  Circle Us         Watch Us on Youtube  Watch Us       

TheBrain Mind Map & Mindmapping Software     Download TheBrain Mind Mapping Software