Cornan
It has been requested before that PB NOT add thoughts to an Expanded View too when a thought is made active, with no undo.

Now that TYPEs can be made active on the plex, accidentally activating a thought type in the plex (say, to edit the thought type) can add a whole shower of unwanted thoughts and/or types into the plex, still without undo.

This behavior needs to get FIXED.  This was and is a SERIOUS DESIGN PROBLEM with the way thoughts are added to the plex in Expanded View and is only getting WORSE.

Just look at this mess, all caused by a single click !


(edited 9/25/10 to clarify that it is trying to edit the thought type that put the thought type on the Expanded View plex, initiating the bad behavior).
Quote
jostber
That's a mess all right. Expanded view in the present form is not really suitable to show many thoughts as once. This view, as with links, has not gotten implemented any new features in a long time either.

I bet that the algorithm to place the thoughts is a dedicated place is pretty complex, but as of now the presentation is not optimal. One feature that could help this was if f.ex. Ctrl-+ could expand thoughts outward in the plex from the active thought. This would make it quick to make more room between thoughts so that they would more readable. Ctrl-- could do the opposite, and Ctrl-= could get thoughs back to original Expanded view.




TheBrain 8.0.2.2 Slackware 14.2 KDE 4.10.3 Java 1.8 / (Windows 7)
Quote
HanBav
I agree with cornan not to add connected thoughts without clicking a +.

It is really a pity that expanded view has so many flaws.

I still think that expanded view is an important differentiating feature of Pbrain. But maybe not many users really use it? If this is true: is it not used because it is a mess or is not much programming effort applied because it is not used?
... Furthermore I think TheBrain is unique
regards Hannes from Bavaria
Brain Junky V6.x Pro / WebBrain / V7 Beta /
Win 7 Prof 64 & 32, MS Office 2010 & Outlook & Firefox & IE
Quote
rhodes

Hi Cornan, nice to see you haven't lost your indignation about these issues that beset us all!

Every time Expanded View starts to get me down, which is often, I recite Hannes' signature quote several times like a mantra:

Quote:
Furthermore I think PersonalBrain is unique

after that, things seem to improve and are placed in perspective...

Seriously, what helps me in this situation is to right-click (or r-click-drag), not left-click any thought in the plex; then it won't explode. Alternatively, if you left-click it unthinkingly, make sure you drag it slightly before releasing the left mouse button. Dragging also prevents activation.

In addition, if your plex should suddenly become flooded, why not try my idea of pinning an orphan thought named Active to the pin bar. In each Expanded View, click it on the pin bar to activate it and add it to the current plex. Save the plex with Active in the view but it could even be offscreen out of the way. Now, when the plex gets flooded, click Active on the pin bar and then the Collapse tab on the thought that exploded will reappear. Click it and it will collapse. (Yeah, I know it's another workaround for the fact that the active thought has no Collapse tab, but it works.)

Some more suggestions for taming Expanded View are in these 2 threads:
http://forums.thebrain.com/post?id=4891745
http://forums.thebrain.com/post?id=4896911

Hope they help.

Alan Rhodes
Quote
Cornan
Hi, Jostber,
   The biggest flaw for me in Expanded View is that thoughts are added when I don't want them to be added.  As there is already a method to add thoughts (the + tombstones) there is no need to add them spontaneously upon making a thought active, which seems to follow no [reasonable] logic in any event.

   Second of course is that I'm not prompted to save changes when I leave an Expanded View, but I can usually remember that.

   In addition, while I haven't done a "scientific" survey, I think the developers need to add more "spontaneous" [i.e. PersonalBrain initiated] actions to the undo engine.  In this case, I made a thought type active because I was trying to edit the thought type, and those 50+ thoughts were blasted into my plex. (... and "edit thought" has been replaced by making thought types appear in the plex, a big mistake for Expanded View)

    There wasn't any "Undo" for "adding thoughts to the plex", so my only choices were to individually prune the unwanted thoughts or to abandon my changes to the Expanded View and start over.

   I've noticed a few other cases where things that PersonalBrain itself decided to do (i.e. not a keystroke per se) were missing from the undo engine.

   Not only Expanded View, but the plex in general hasn't received much attention in a while.  "Sync" is a good feature, though "Private" thoughts (or some similar feature) are not excluded, so it can't be used to generate a collaboration space (so close!).


   But other strongly requested features (thought formatting, timeline, better arrange options) and my own request for a limited "grandfather"  level to avoid "empty plex syndrome" in Normal View have not been implemented (my request made it up to #10 in UserVoice at one time).



Quote
Cornan
rhodes, did you notice that editing the thought type generated a new opportunity for the explosive additions of new thoughts in Expanded View?

I was struggling to edit a thought type (edit thought was SO much easier) when the event that started this thread occurred.

PersonalBrain is unique.
PersonalBrain is unique.
PersonalBrain is unique.

Yes, it does help a little

Quote
jostber
Hi, Cornan. I understand your issue with too many thoughts getting opened in Expanded view when you are working there. My point was that we could also need a way to easily expand the thoughts in the plex itself with a keyboard command so they could be made more viewable.
TheBrain 8.0.2.2 Slackware 14.2 KDE 4.10.3 Java 1.8 / (Windows 7)
Quote
Cornan
jostber, are you aware that you can adjust the spacing in Expanded View in the plex with a mouse wheel?

I agree completely that there should be a keyboard command for expanding the "space" in Expanded View, because:
1) not everybody uses mouse wheels, and
2) there's a driver problem of some sort, also affecting other software packages, involving the (Windows) Microsoft Intellimouse software in particular.

This feature has worked very inconsistently.  I think they wanted you to use Ctrl+mouse wheel, but sometimes the mouse wheel alone seems to work.

I thought the Intellimouse problem was fixed (can only size in one direction until it reaches the limit and then you have to restart PB), but I see this morning that it's back in the 6.0 beta.


Quote
rhodes

Quote:
rhodes, did you notice that editing the thought type generated a new opportunity for the explosive additions of new thoughts in Expanded View?

I don't see how this can be so, at least not the way I do it. To change a thought type I R-click the thought to open its context menu, then click Thought Type. R-clicking a thought does not activate it, therefore changing its type should not either. Does your method for changing type differ from mine?

Alan Rhodes
Quote
HanBav
rhodes, thank you for quoting my signature.
Never thought that it might reduce pain

It is like with democracy: It is really unsufficient and often annoying but still the best available way of living together in a big crowd.

So I am most of the time happy for being stumbled upon PB and appreciate this forum with people like you.

Thanks for the trick with right click and the orphan thought. Quite advanced! After all I like those crazy workarounds that remind me to the time early programmers had to use every dirty trick to make things possible that were impossible by definition or nature.

I just think about a wording for Harlan's marketing to sell those as a feature for a quite mature EV 
... Furthermore I think TheBrain is unique
regards Hannes from Bavaria
Brain Junky V6.x Pro / WebBrain / V7 Beta /
Win 7 Prof 64 & 32, MS Office 2010 & Outlook & Firefox & IE
Quote
Cornan
Hi, rhodes,
I didn't want to switch to a different thought type, I wanted to edit the thought type itself.

Because "Edit Thought" has been removed from the program, the only way to edit a thought is to make it visible in the plex.

Visible... and active.  Not so bad in Normal View, but in Expanded View...

BLAMMO!

Quote
rhodes

Hi Cornan

Quote:
I didn't want to switch to a different thought type, I wanted to edit the thought type itself.

Sorry I must have misunderstood you on that one.

Okay then. When I want to do that in 5.5, I have prepared an accelerator key for Preferences > Accelerators > Thoughts > Properties & Attachments. (I use F4 for this as I have no need for PB's "Search Web" function.) So I hover over the thought whose type I want to edit (using my R hand to move the mouse), press F4 with my L hand, and - hey presto! - up pops the P&A window to enable me to edit the thought's type, all without disturbing the sleeping beast.

I haven't tried this out on v6.0 because for one thing I won't be running 6.0 and 5.5 side by side until they fix 6.0 so it doesn't set my carefully prepared 5.5 layout to default. Judging by the latest posts here, 6.0 still causes grief to 5.5 layouts. So please let me know whether this method works in 6.0.

Alan Rhodes
Quote
HanBav
ctrl shift T opens type-list when hovering above non active thought in EV
assigning a type does not activate this thought.

F4 (if redefined) opens thought window.

Both is also possible by rightclicking & calling from contextmenu by mouse
or hovering and calling context-menu with windows-key on keyboard right of space.

... Furthermore I think TheBrain is unique
regards Hannes from Bavaria
Brain Junky V6.x Pro / WebBrain / V7 Beta /
Win 7 Prof 64 & 32, MS Office 2010 & Outlook & Firefox & IE
Quote
Cornan
rhodes, I checked this out as I have both 5.5 and 6.0 running.

You can still generate a "thought window" in 6.0 (AKA Properties & Attachments), but "Edit Type" has been removed, so while it is possible to switch to a different type, the only way I know to edit a type (change the characteristics of the type itself) in 6.0 beta is to make the type active in the plex (unless of course we talk them into reverting to the earlier, better behavior).

Not only is type editing only possible while a type is active in the plex, the only way to make a type appear in the plex seems to be to use Instant Search and click on the type.

Harder to get to (type editing), bad side effects in Expanded View.  Not a good move for those of us who maintain their thought types fairly frequently.

Disturbingly, the accelerator I attached in 5.5 appeared by itself in 6.0, so there is obviously still some level of "crosstalk" between the two releases, even though the PB folk don't believe this is true (my instance of 5.5 doesn't work with a command line brain argument any more either).

Quote
zenrain
Quote:
Not only is type editing only possible while a type is active in the plex, the only way to make a type appear in the plex seems to be to use Instant Search and click on the type.


There's two more ways to skin that cat.

You can also make a type appear by clicking the circle arrow under the Thought tab, next to the type's name. (see image below).

Finally, you can make a type appear by choosing Options > Thought Types Window, and clicking on the types in the resulting window.

It won't help with the Blammo!, in this topic, but will hopefully help you maintain your thought types.
Click image for larger version - Name: type.png, Views: 101, Size: 7.32 KB
Windows 7
J-1.6.0_22
--
OSX 10.6.3
Java SE 6
Quote

Newsletter Signup  Newsletter        Visit TheBrain Blog   Blog       Follow us on Twitter   Twitter       Like Us on Facebook   Facebook         Circle Us on Google+  Google         Watch Us on Youtube  YouTube       

TheBrain Mind Map & Mindmapping Software     Download TheBrain Mind Mapping Software